WHOSE CHURCH IS IT ANYWAY?

THE POST APOSTOLIC CHURCH

THE CHURCH 100-325AD

We will see, as we proceed from the death of John round 100AD (generally considered to be the end of the Apostolic Age), that the gifts of the Holy Spirit continued to operate amongst many believers, even as they were rejected by the formalized church that started to develop from this time.

There are a number of historical writers and records confirming the continuation of spiritual gifts. I must first acknowledge that much of the material that follows is drawn from the excellent publication by Eddie L. Hyatt, 2000 Years of Charismatic Christianity. For specific references to the writings quoted, please refer to that publication.

Let's have a look at the experiences of these early followers of Jesus.....

Justin Martyr (AD100-165) (Pictured) Justin, brilliant wandering philosopher, was converted when he met an elderly man on a beach, who pointed out 'the way' to him. He went on to open a Christian school in Rome. Generally regarded as the leading apologist of the 2nd century, he wrote in his "Dialogue With Trypho".....

"For the prophetical gifts remain with us even to the present time." and "Now it is possible to see among us women and men who possess gifts of the Spirit of God."

In "The Second Apology of Justin", he further wrote.....

For numberless demoniacs throughout the whole world, and in your city, many of our Christian men exorcising them in the name of Jesus Christ, who was crucified under Pontius Pilate, have healed and do heal, rendering helpless and driving the possessing devils out of the men.

It is clear that, in Justin's time, spiritual gifts were still active amongst the body of believers.

Irenaeus (AD 125-200), bishop of Lyons, is best known for his writings against gnosticism and other heresies of the day. Born in Smyrna, he was a student of Polycarp, the well known disciple of the apostle John.

In refuting gnosticism, in Against Heresies, he proclaimed the works of the believers to include.....

For some do certainly and truly drive out devils, so that those who have been thus cleansed from evil spirits frequently both believe [in Christ], and join themselves to the Church. Others have foreknowledge of things to come: they see visions and utter prophetic expressions. Others still heal the sick by laying their hands upon them, and they are made whole.

Iranaeus speaks too, of the dead being raised.....

Yea, moreover, as I have said, the dead even have been raised up, and remained among us for many years. And what shall I more say? It is not possible to name the number of gifts which the Church [scattered] throughout the whole world has received from God in the name of Jesus Christ.

.....and of people prophesying and speaking in tongues.....

In like manner we do also hear many brethren in the Church who possess prophetic gifts and who through the Spirit speak all kinds of languages, and bring to light for the general benefit the hidden things of men, and declare the mysteries of God.

Therefore it can be concluded that the operation of the spiritual gifts was alive and active throughout the life if Iranaeus. Nor was there any expectation that the operation of the gifts would cease.

So we can continue to say that.....

THE TRUE FOLLOWERS OF JESUS ARE ONES WHO ARE OBEDIENT TO THE LEADING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT IN THEIR LIVES.

(This section to be continued next week.)

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FROM THE WORD

THE WORDS OF JESUS

The Lord has asked me to compile a publication of the words Jesus spoke, as recorded in the New Testament in chronological order. I have got about halfway, and have found it very enlightening and encouraging in my relationship with Him. The final version will have changes of layout and version used, but this is a foretaste of things to come. Of course, it is not a Bible substitute! I Hope you find it helpful too, in your walk with Jesus.

The Boy Jesus at the Temple (Luke 2:41-52)

“Why were you searching for me?” “Didn’t you know I had to be in my Father’s house?”

The Baptism of Jesus (Matthew 4:13-17, Mark 1:9-11, Luke 3:21-3, John 1:33-4)

“Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.”

The Temptation of Jesus (Matthew 4:1-11, Mark 1:12-13, Luke 4:1-13)

“It is written: ‘Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”
“It is also written: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’”
“Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’”

The Calling of the First Disciples (Matthew 4:18-22, Mark 1:16-20, Luke 5:1-11, John 1:35-42)

“Put out into deep water, and let down the nets for a catch.”
“Don’t be afraid; from now on you will catch men.”
“What do you want?”
“Come,” “and you will see.”
“You are Simon son of John. You will be called Cephas”

Jesus Calls Philip and Nathanael (John 1:43-50)

“Follow me.”
“Here is a true Israelite, in whom there is nothing false.”
“I saw you while you were still under the fig tree before Philip called you.”
“You believe because I told you I saw you under the fig tree. You shall see greater things than that.” “I tell you the truth, you shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending on the Son of Man.”

Jesus Changes Water to Wine (John 2:1-11)

“Dear woman, why do you involve me?” “My time has not yet come.”
“Fill the jars with water”;
“Now draw some out and take it to the master of the banquet.”

Jesus Clears the Temple (John 2:12-25)

“Get these out of here! How dare you turn my Father’s house into a market!”
“Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.”

Jesus Teaches Nicodemus (John 3:1-21)

“I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.”
“I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’ The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”
“You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things? I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man. Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.
“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.”

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DAVID'S DOODLINGS

TRIALS AND TESTINGS

591. The view is from the mountaintops but growth comes in the fertile valley soils.

592. Trials are a real trial!

593. Trials build character, character Godliness.

594. A test done, a test won, while not much fun, it pleases the Son.

595. Tests require change. Little change requires greater tests.

596. If we were already perfect, we would no longer need trials and testings. Life tells me I have not yet got there!

597. A trial a day keeps the devil away.

598. Heat draws out dross. In gold, silver and me!

599. Failing a test means I need to take it again!

600. The unbearable becomes bearable through God’s grace.

601. Trials are for life’s winners!

602. The ladder of testing is best climbed one step at a time.

603. The best fruit grows on pruned trees.

604. An unpruned tree produces little fruit.

605. Heated and treated gold glistens. It’s the same with us!

Please feel free to quote these quotes. Acknowledgement of David Tait as the author would be appreciated. There are now over 1300 David sayings for you to view at ...

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CARTOONS FROM TOON FEVER

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TUESDAY TEACHINGS

THIS WEEK: A REVELATION OF...
THE SEVEN REVELATIONS OF THE LAMB - Part 5

The coming of the 'Lamb of God' Himself was, and remains, the pivotal point in history.

Without the death and resurrection of Jesus we would be completely without comfort in a human centred world.

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LAUGHING AT OURSELVES

***Blessed are those who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease to be amused***

*** Those who can't laugh at themselves leave the job to others. ***

779. THE WATERMELON
Discovering too late that a watermelon spiked with vodka had accidentally been served to a luncheon meeting of local ministers, the restaurant's owner waited nervously for the clerics' reaction.

"Quick," he whispered to the waiter, "what did they say?"

"Nothing," replied the waiter. "They were all too busy slipping the seeds into their pockets."

778. ANOTHER ARK
One day, God speaks to Noah. 'Noah', he says, 'I want you to build another Ark.'
'What, like the last one?' asks Noah.

'Yes' replies God, 'Except this time, I want it to have 14 decks.'

'And shall I lead all the animals into it, two by two, like last time? says Noah.

'No, this time I only want you to lead fish into it'. Noah is a little puzzled. 'Just fish?' he asks.

'Yes' says God. 'In fact, just carp.'

'Just carp? Why carp?' Noah quizzes.

'Well,' says God, 'I've always wanted a multi-storey carp Ark'

777. YOU MUST BE A PASTOR IF...
You've dreamed you were preaching only to waken and discover that YOU WERE.

You'd rather negotiate with terrorists than the CHURCH ORGANIST.

You've ever wanted to FIRE THE WHOLE CHURCH and form a congregation search committee.

You've been tempted to take up an offering at a FAMILY REUNION.

You've ever wanted to give the sound man some FEEDBACK of your own.

You've ever wanted to lay hands on a deacon, and you didn't mean PRAYING FOR HIM.

You've never PREACHED ON TV, because your wife made you get down before you broke something.

Your sermons have a happy ending...everyone's HAPPY WHEN IT ENDS!!

" FREE DOWNLOAD: You can now download the book 'Laughing At Ourselves' in PDF format at LAUGHING AT OURSELVES One of the most comprehensive sources of Christian Humour on the Net with 800 sermon fillers for your entertainment and use at ...

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FACTS FOR FUN

LAST WEEKS QUESTION: What happened to Pontius Pilate after he sentenced Christ to be crucified?

ANSWER: As could be expected, things went rapidly downhill from there. Pilate ended up killing himself in 36 AD after Caligula ordered him to come to Rome to explain his actions in the massacre of some Samaritans. It is unclear whether Caligula ordered the suicide or Pilate simply feared harsh punishment. (An inevitable judgment.)

THIS WEEK'S QUESTION: When was the first animal cloned?

Answer Next Week.

SOME FUN FACTS

826. SOMETHING TO DO?
Icelanders are highly literate; they read more books per capita than any other people in the world. (A long time between Summers?)

827. THE FIRST COLD WAR!
During World War II, the U.S. Navy commissioned the world's first floating ice cream parlour for service in the Pacific theatre. This concrete barge, capable of producing ten gallons of ice cream every seven seconds, kept ships well supplied. (I scream for an ice cream!)

828. YOU 'PREGNANT GODFISH' YOU!
Pregnant goldfish are called ‘twits.’ (And you thought you were being really abusive when you called someone a pregnant goldfish?)

A WORD PUZZLE FOR YOU

Make another word from this word using all the letters.

STERLING

Answer at the end of A David Musing

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66 BOOKS... 66 QUESTIONS

66: Revelation: How many trumpets were held by the angels?

a. Four
b. Five
c. Six
d. Seven

Source: http://biblequizzes.org.uk

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IF ONLY I'D THOUGHT OF IT!

"""OTHER'S SAYINGS TO ENLIGHTEN, AMUSE, OR BEMUSE"""

AIN'T IT THE TRUTH!

!!!!!!! The easiest way to find something lost around the house is to buy a replacement.

!!!!!! He who hesitates is probably right.

!!!!! Did you ever notice: The Roman numerals for forty (40) are 'XL'?

!!!! The sole purpose of a child's middle name is so he can tell when he's really in trouble.

!!! One of the many things no one tells you about aging is that it is such a nice change from being young.

!! Long ago when men cursed and beat the ground with sticks, it was called witchcraft. Today, it's called golf.

! Being young is beautiful, but being old is comfortable.

100'S MORE TO BE FOUND AT...

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GREAT GROANERS!

1. MAKING DOUGH
Years ago there was a baker's assistant whose sole job was to pour the dough mixture for making sausage rolls (apparently the royal family loved sausage). Because people were identified by their professions, he was just called Richard the Pourer.

One day Richard ran out of some key ingredients, namely a secret spice he used in the batter. He called his apprentice and sent him to the store to buy more spices. When the apprentice arrived at the store, he found that he had forgotten the name of the ingredient. Hoping that the storekeeper might be able to figure it out, he described it to him,

"it's for Richard the Pourer for batter for wurst."

2. THE WINTER DRILL
During the cold months, we keep our little ceramic elves that we use in the garden during the summer, stored overhead in the garage. At Halloween time, when I went out in the garage, I imagined I could hear them up there, mocking me. It sounded like they were marching and doing military-type exercises.....

Ever since then, I've been scared of gnome attic drills.

by David Reihmer

3. AWOL
A sailor was caught AWOL as he tried to sneak on board his ship at about 3 am.

The chief petty officer spied him and ordered the sailor to stop. Upon hearing the sailor's lame explanation for his tardiness, the officer ordered the sailor, "Take this broom and sweep every link on this anchor chain by morning or it's the brig for you!"

The sailor began to pick up the broom and commence performing his charge. As he began to sweep, a tern landed on the broom handle. The sailor yelled at the bird to leave, but it didn't. The lad picked the tern off the broom handle, giving the bird a toss. The bird left, only to return and light once again on the broom handle. The sailor went through the same routine all over again, with the same result. He couldn't get any cleaning done because he can only sweep at the chain once or twice before the blasted bird returns.

When morning came, so did the chief petty officer, to check up on his wayward sailor.

"What in the heck have you been doing all night? This chain is no cleaner than when you started! What have you to say for yourself, sailor?" barked the chief.

"Honest, chief," came the reply, "I tossed a tern all night and couldn't sweep a link!"

4. IN THE CEMETERY
A man was walking past a graveyard and he heard one of Beethoven's symphonys playing backwards. He thought to himself "That's weird" and kept walking.

The next day the same man walked past the same cemetery and heard another one of Beethoven's symphonys playing backwards. He thought to himself, "Now that's REALLY weird!" and kept going.

The next day the same man was once again walking past the same cemetery and heard "Ode to Joy" playing backwards. The man said "I can't take this any more!" He walked up to the caretaker and asked, "What is going on around here?!"

The caretaker answered, "Oh, that's just Beethoven decomposing."

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BIBLE TRIVIA (About The Bible)

THE EARLIEST REFERENCES TO THE OLD TESTAMENT.....

.....were 'the law of Moses', 'the law of the Lord', or simply, 'Moses'. Since the additional writings wee considered the work of prophets, the common term became 'Moses and the Prophets', or similar. Note: Whenever the word 'law' is seen, the Jewish reference would be 'Torah'. By New Testament times, 'Scripture' or 'the Scriptures' became common. The simplest generic term for the whole collection was 'writings', often with 'sacred' or 'holy' added.

Adapted from: '1001 Surprising Things You Should Know About The Bible' MacGregor & Prys

5 Reasons to Bless Those Who Curse You

Dr. Michael Brown

How did God deal with us when we were lost in sin and walking in ignorance? Did he damn us to hell forever? Did he curse us with eternal judgment? No. He sent his Son to die for us, showing us mercy when we deserved wrath.

That is the pattern we must follow when dealing with the lost. Otherwise, we will only repeat the cycle of hatred and anger.

Earlier this week, in response to my article “Gov. Christie Signs Discrimination into Law,” someone we’ll call “h.b.” posted this comment: “What Brown is telling is lies, and he has an iq of a 5 year old. I have a phd in homosexuality.”

Later in the day, after my colleague and friend Matt Barber retweeted the article, calling it a “must read,” h.b. had some choice tweets for Matt and me, writing, “------- ***holes with an IQ of a 5 year old,” followed by, “f***king s***heads who should get brain cancer and not exist anymore.” (All the profanity was spelled out in full.) That sounds like a curse!

I tweeted back, “May God's truth and grace be yours! Also, you posted that you have a PhD in homosexuality. Where did you earn that?”

When I clicked on h.b.’s twitter page, I found similar comments blasting other Christian leaders (although with the wish for brain cancer), sometimes in response to a simple gospel message that wasn’t confrontational in the least, and when I read the tweets, my heart went out to h.b.

There was a time when I too was full of anger, profanity, and uncleanness, and rather than smiting me in judgment, God pursued me with his convicting love. As Paul wrote to the Romans, “at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly” (Rom 5:6). And Jesus set the pattern for us!

Here are five reasons why we should bless those who curse us.

1. This is the way of a Jesus revolutionary, emulating the example of our Father. The Sermon on the Mount is a counterculture, kingdom manifesto where Jesus calls us to live by different principles than the world and religious establishment) live by. And in the Sermon on the Mount, he gave this explicit command: “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you” (Matt 5:43-44).

When we do this, we are emulating God himself, who “causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous” (Matt 5:45). This is part of our calling to “be perfect” as our heavenly Father is perfect (Matt 5:48).

2. God demonstrates extraordinary longsuffering towards those who walk in ignorance and unbelief. A few years ago, there was an atheist-inspired internet sensation featuring thousands of people who recorded short video clips of themselves claiming to blaspheme the Spirit. As I watched the clips, I said to myself, “Not too long from now, many of these people will be gloriously saved, sharing internet testimonies and thanking God for his mercy.”

As Paul explained in 1 Timothy 1, “Even though I was once a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent man, I was shown mercy because I acted in ignorance and unbelief. . . . for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his unlimited patience as an example for those who would believe on him and receive eternal life” (1 Tim 1:13, 16).

3. When we bless, a blessing is returned to us. In many, many ways, we reap what we sow, and that’s one of the reasons Peter gave this exhortation to his readers: “Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing” (1 Pet 3:9).

What do you want to inherit, blessing or cursing? That’s what you should speak to others.

4. Words of grace and patience produce more good fruit than words of anger and frustration. There are certainly times when it is right to correct and even rebuke, but we must always do so in love (Ephesians 4:15) and patience (2 Timothy 2:24-26), remembering that, “A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger” (Prov 15:1).

A few months ago, I was reminded that we really don’t know what’s happening in a person’s life. I had challenged the views of a woman who consistently defended abortion on Christian websites, and a few days after our last interaction, she posted this note publicly on my Facebook page: “I want to apologize for writing crazy comments about killing babies about your article. I was trying to live without God and his principles in my life. I thought about the happiest time of my life. That was when I was going to church and living for God. Please pray for me. Thank you.”

Here was a hurting woman, wanting to come back to God, yet I didn’t have the slightest clue that this was what was fueling her pro-abortion fire. Sadly, all too often I have been guilty of responding to people quickly rather than thoughtfully, thereby hardening them in their position rather than helping them to see the error of their ways.

5. When we bless those who curse us, we break the cycle of anger and hatred. This was Paul’s counsel to the Roman believers, following Proverbs 25:21-22: “‘If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head.’ Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good” (Rom 12:20-21).

Let’s break ugly, destructive cycle of the flesh and follow in the footsteps of our Master who forgave those who crucified him.

It is the path to life and blessing – not just for us, but also for those who oppose us.

Source: Charisma News

Via: OpenHeaven.com

DAVID'S DOWNLOAD

UP THE MOUNTAIN

An exciting yet challenging allegory of one man’s spiritual journey and his participation in the fulfilment of God’s plan.

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WAXING LYRICAL

When all else fails, we have our family! Or we should. When our family fails, they are still our family! Or they should be. Our family is our greatest source of both pleasure and frustration. They know us best. We cannot fool them. So here is a little about our family. Since the poem was written Andrew and Catriona have produced our baby Eva, our first grandchild. But 20,000km away in Scotland! Thankyou Lord for emails! (PS: This is round 15 years old now. Needs updating!)

LIFE’S A LAWNMOWER, MATE!

Uptown, I heard a new saying - life’s a lawnmower mate?
Like us, in a range of models, whose features we debate.
Mechanical and manual, rotary and reel,
Push types and ride-ons, all made of steel.
Being sold with a promise, yes, so sparkling and new,
But we know they mean work, before we’re all through!
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

Like a new baby, right out of the box,
Full of promise, when kept off the rocks
Of trouble, that can soon blunt our blades,
Just as we look set, to mow many glades.
To mow through life, needs that something special,
If we are to succeed, to develop our full potential.
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

Take my life’s lawnmower for instance,
A racy model, but will it last the distance?
For the challenge of a newly grown field, I will always look,
Something different, preferably new, but never by the book.
Though sometimes to discover, I’ve bitten off more than I can chew!
To learn the art of patience, to pace myself, that is what I must do.
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

My wife Kathy, is a model so different,
With a long stroke bore, reliable, diligent.
For she was born like her mother, a nurse she’d always be,
Until she revved her sweet engine, ending up marrying me!
The years that followed, oft times were filled with pain,
Now she’s finally fulfilled, having gone nursing again.
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

Our eldest son Andrew was not a lawnmower fan,
Mowing lawns and gardening do not make the man!
So he revved up his mower for a journey over the sea,
To the land of Scotland, so his own man he could be.
Once settled, he was motivated to make a good living,
So tuning his motor, he went landscape gardening!
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

As the business built up, his lawnmower faster would run,
Until the day he realised, two mowers were better than one.
So he found a gorgeous, sleek new model, Catriona by name,
Another nurse, could be worse, their directions both the same,
For their mutual desire is to start a new church,
To harvest people, not leave them in the lurch.
Oh yes, life’s a lawnmower, mate!

Concludes here.....

http://wwj.org.nz/waxing.php?poemId=00006

A DAVID MUSING

A door partially closes. Oh dear.

Suddenly, out of the blue, another opens!

Verbal agreement! Still waiting on confirmation in writing.

That waiting word continues! Another week.....

Until next week.....

MAY GOD BLESS YOU AND YOU BLESS GOD

His servant and yours

David Tait

Today's 'Word Puzzle' Answer: RINGLETS

TODAY'S 'BIBLE QUESTION' d. Seven (Revelation 8:6)

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ABOUT US

WALKING WITH JESUS MINISTRIES is a non-profit, non-denominational, Bible based ministry located in Hastings, New Zealand. A ministry dedicated to developing discipleship, fostering unity amongst God’s people to achieve the Great Commission, and in doing so, preparing for Christ’s return. It is securely based upon the foundational principles of the Apostles Creed while recognising the wide and rich diversity of beliefs amongst Christians in other areas. In accordance with the Lord’s direction, materials produced by the ministry are available, free of charge, to genuine enquirers upon request. The ministry is solely funded by donations, as the Lord provides. A list of materials available (plus some fun!) is obtainable and freely downloadable from our website
wwj.org.nz or by contacting us as follows.

Walking With Jesus Ministries
7 Bull Street
Ahuriri
Napier
New Zealand

Phone: (06) 835 0567 International (+64) 6 835 0567

Email: enquiries@wwj.org.nz
Web: wwj.org.nz

Our role is to bless and encourage those in ministry while promoting co-operation and unity of direction amongst the body of Christ, as emphasised 3 times by Jesus in His longest prayer, immediately prior to His arrest and crucifixion. "… so that they may be one as we are one." (John 17:12, 21, 23-4) Our website is currently being developed to encourage your participation one with another, to share resources, and to enable you to promote events and items of interest to the body as a whole – and have a smile while doing it!

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